original data plates

lendlease · Post by **lendlease** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 11:42 pm

G'day Guys!
Just wanted to know if anyone can tell me when (chassis number) CCKW's changed from brass to aluminium data plates. I have a friend with a H1 tipper/dump chassis number 164855. Nov/Dec, 1942.
Thanks mate!

Matt · Post by **Matt** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:42 am

Hi Ross,

I'm not sure exactly but somtime in early 1944,maybe someone else on here knows more??.

With that chassis number it's very doubtful your friends truck started out as an H1 as the tippers came much later than Nov/Dec 42. does the chassis number actually have the -H1 after it on the chassis?.

That truck is very close to my compressor truck which is chassis number 162610-1.

Cheers,

Matt.

lendlease · Post by **lendlease** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 5:08 am

G'day Matt!
Yes, he assures me the chassis stamped like this......CCKW 353 164855 H1. The truck is in New Zealand and was supposedly surplussed from US Navy/Marine stcoks in 1945 or thereabouts. It is an open cab with winch and Timken diffs. I have a couple of pics I can send you if you want.
Thanks mate!

armydriver · Post by **armydriver** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 6:41 am

Nov/Dec of 42 is too early for an open cab truck. Spring fo 43 for open cabs. I wonder if it is a rework with a cab replacement. One never knows on trucks used in theater.

42cckw · Post by **42cckw** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 7:51 am

The fact that there were only closed cab trucks prior to the spring of 43 is not true. There were 1619 open cab trucks built in 1942 in very small numbers.Take a look at GMC Trucks at war under government contract W-398-QM-11595 there are 6 examples of 1942 production of turcks with 1619 open cabs 1-1076 vehicles with 1619 open cab- no boby- no winch-banjo axles. 2-1118 vehicles with 1619 open cab- no body -no winch-split typs axles. 3- 4795 vehicles with 1619 open cab-cargo body-no winch-banjo axles. 4- 2505 vehicles with 1619 open cab- cargo body-with winch -banjo axles. 5 -2227 vehicles with 1619 open cab -cargo body -no winch-split type axles. 6 - 4674 vehicles with 1619 open cab -cargo body-with winch-split type axles. All these vehicles have a 1942 model year production some 16,395 trucks made prior to spring of 1943 , they are out there

I hope this lets the air out of the myth that open cab trucks were made only after 1943

All this information is available in GMC TRUCKS AT WAR Portrayal Press

Kees51 · Post by **Kees51** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 12:36 pm

In the Bryce Sunderlin article series it is noted in Part VI that the change to open cab was done gradually between august 42 and may 43. From may 43 on only open cabs were made, but in the half year before that, both cabs were in production.

But in table V in Part I it is stated that serial nrs 162460-162988 should have the model 1608 closed cab.

Bryce does not mention aluminium data plates in his articles. All nomenclature plates from the war are etched zinc he says in Part VIII. Only the Ornance Shop Van (ST-6 body) GMCs had brass data plates. Any other brass data plates are postwar replacements.

Someone with a lot of free time really should retype all the articles so we can make them searchable

Matt · Post by **Matt** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:36 pm

While I am not questioning the value of the articles by Bryce Sunderlin or the amount of research which went into them,there are a few errors.

The brass dataplate was in use during ww2 and it is illustrated in TM 9-801,April 1944.

Matt.

Kees51 · Post by **Kees51** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 6:28 am

Now I read the post again I note I misread the serial number. 164855 falls in the range 163858-166307 which means closed cab type 1619.

Has there ever been made an erratum about the errors in the Sundelin articles? Apart from part 10 I mean. It would be great if we could compile the definitive version for the site.

lendlease · Post by **lendlease** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 9:16 pm

What is the differences between the closed cabs..........1608 and 1619? Many? I have two original re-assembly manuals which show differences in the firewall. One manual is very early....no date, but most likely 1941. The other one is 1943 and shows closed and open type cabs.
Thanks mate!

Kees51 · Post by **Kees51** » Tue Jun 27, 2006 6:16 am

What is the differences between the closed cabs..........1608 and 1619?

It seems we found another error in the Sunderlin articles. In the table I mentioned he calls both cab types 1608 and 1619 a closed cab.

But several other sites that have CCKW specifications say that 1608 is the closed cab and 1619 is the open cab. That would mean that the cab on your friends GMC is correct.

Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Matt · Post by **Matt** » Tue Jun 27, 2006 7:36 am

Model 1574 closed cab,used on CCKWX and first contract CCKW. has the civvy style dash and other minor differences to later closed cabs.

Model 1575 closed cab,ditto above but with ring in roof for use with gun mounts,limited production.

Model 1608 closed cab,basically the same as model 1574 but has military style dash,mirror arm mounted on cowl as opposed to on door hinge etc.

Model 1609 closed cab,ditto above but ring in roof for use with gun mounts.

Model 1619 open cab.

Hope this helps,

Matt.

armydriver · Post by **armydriver** » Tue Jun 27, 2006 10:06 pm

Thanks 42CCKW for the correction to my post. I had only read Bryces article and had no idea that it was wrong as it has kind of been the final source for so long. Of course I am an old guy and my memory is not what it used to be.

You young guys are too sharp for us old geezers.

The GMC CCKW

original data plates

original data plates

data plates

cab differences